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|Tear Gas Bomb Blats in Mosque in a Parisian Suburb|
|11/08/05 at 14:40:25|
|Tear Gas Bomb Blats in Mosque in a Parisian Suburb |
Tuesday, November 01 2005 @ 07:58 AM Eastern Standard Time
The clashes between youths and police in Paris suburbs, which begun last week, continue.
A group of around 150 youths clashed with security forces on Sunday night at Clichy-sous-Bois.
Meanwhile a tear gas bomb was thrown into a mosque during prayer time. The neighborhoods became a battle field and many police cars were set fire to. The unrest was triggered by the tragic death of two teenagers who were electrocuted while attempting to hide from police in a power sub-station. Youths in the neighborhood rioted, claiming, “Police knowingly chased the teenagers to their deaths” and have turned their neighborhoods into a battle field. Muhittin Altun, 18, a Turkish boy from Urfa, who had taken shelter in the power sub-station along with the two dead teenagers, went into a coma; however he regained consciousness on Monday. The French Prosecutor investigating the incident related that the three boys escaping from police had no previous criminal record. Residents of the neighborhoods connected with the incidents expressed their reaction by conducting a silent rally held over the weekend.
Unrest Continues at Montfermeil
The explosion of a tear gas bomb thrown into a mosque during prayer in the Montfermeil neighborhood on Sunday upset Muslims in the city. The mosque congregation asserted that they had witnessed police using tear gas bombs in the area at the time. French officials on the other side reassured that it was impossible for security units to undertake such an act. However, later it emerged that the tear gas bombs were of the type used by the special security forces deployed in the neighborhood. Police officials maintain that the grenades were not thrown by security forces and suspect provocative intent.
On the same night some 150 youths clashed with police in the densely populated suburb of Montfermeil, which also has a high population of Turkish immigrants. Around ten police cars and numerous waste bins were set fire to during the incident in which twenty youths were taken into. The government deployed large numbers of special police forces to the neighborhood. A Turkish citizen who witnessed the clash between police and youths in the neighborhood told Zaman their neighborhood turned into a battle field and that hundreds of police were patrolling on their doorsteps. The Turkish immigrant, who has lived in Montfermil for 15 years, told the police patrolled the streets with their weapons drawn; they shone lights into peoples’ homes and controlled the meeting points of local immigrants, including Turkish cafés.
France’s Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy sending the message of “zero tolerance” and directing police to effect “arrests” rather than provide security following the clashes met with police officials in the district on Monday. Later, Sarkozy requested to meet with the parents of the teenagers that died; however, they refused to meet with him. Sarkozy told Le Monde daily that about 9,000 police cars had been hit with stones this year and between 20 and 40 police vehicles were set fire to nightly. “Some thugs act as if they own the neighborhoods. We have to change our methods,” he said.
French media: Urban guerillas
The residents of Clichy-sous-Bois in the eastern suburbs of Paris, is mainly composed of African, Turkish, and immigrants from Eastern countries. These immigrants live in public housing built by the French government in the 1960s for immigrant workers. Residents of these ghettoes, where literacy is low and unemployment is high, feel “excluded” from French society. Violent incidents in particular have increased among French-born second and third generation immigrants living in France, bearing French citizenship, and who are disconcerted with the French government and society. The reaction of the French Human Rights League after the Clichy-sous-Bois events pointed out that some politicians have verbally expressed opinions provoking young immigrants living in the “suburbs,” and therefore the increase in violent events was not surprising.
Interior Minister, Dominique Strauss-Khan, a prominent member of the opponent Socialist Party in France, argued that the clashes were an indicator of the failure of Sarkozy’s policy. Khan told TF1 television a level of violence that has never before been seen was being experienced. Former French Premier Laurent Fabius also blamed Sarkozy for creating a bad atmosphere in the problematic suburbs. French media, on the other hand, described the events as having been committed by “urban guerrillas”. According to the French Gendarmerie, about 2,500 cars were set fire to while undertaking surveillance activities in French suburbs in 2004.
They Murder two kids who have No history of crime and they expect Muslims not to demonstrate?
They attack peaceful demonstrations with teargas and they don't expect them to turn in to riots?
They fire teargas grenades in to Musjids during prayers and they don't expect things to get worse?
The teargas grenades they fired in to the Musjid are only issued to one unit of the police who had been active in the area and they expect people to believe them when they deny that the police fired it?
They ban Muslim women from schools and they except Muslims to respect the schools that their sisters and daughters and banned from?
The French seem to think Muslims are some kind of saints. They think that they can treat Muslims like animals and we will respond by treating them like our masters.
The rioters have proved that Muslims like everyone else have a breaking point. The fact that it took 30 years of being treated like animals to cause Muslims to behave in this way proves that we are the most saintly of peoples. Anyone else would have started rioting after thirty minutes of being treated like Muslims!
Every time the French make anti-Muslim laws people warn them that the Muslim population will break. But for thirty years the regimes of France have boosted about how they proved them wrong. For thirty years they boosted about how they can treat their immigrant populations like animals and how they always remain loyal. Well know its time for them to eat their words!
And I hope they chock on them!
The French thought they could control the Muslims by controlling who can be imams. They deported the Imams people trusted and installed puppets in to the Musjid. These puppets told women to remove their Hijabs and Men to allow their daughters to marry Kaffir. And now they are surprised that no one listens to them when they tell the young to stop rioting?
They used to boost about how they deport Imams if they say things the French government does not like.
They used to boost about how they have paid imams, which give them what ever fatwas they want.
Well know that they need people to obey they imams, they can boost about how no one listens to their fatwas to stop rioting!
|Re: Tear Gas Bomb Blats in Mosque in a Parisian Su|
|11/09/05 at 00:45:08|
Rioting is not an Islamic way of action or behavior. There's no way to justify violence and anarchy. If a person claims to be Muslim they should be true to its ideals and follow its path, instead of following their own desires.
I mean did you see the prophet [saw] and his followers setting fire to cars and running wild in the streets or its equivalent? Did you ever hear of him encouraging that? Ever hear of the sahabah doing the same when faced with injustice?
It's true that the socio-economic-racial problems are directly to blame for anger and rioting, but just don't bring anything about islam into it. What people do in their anger is outside of Islamic bounds here.
[quote]They think that they can treat Muslims like animals and we will respond by treating them like our masters. [/quote]
They are not our teachers. Responding like an animal to injustice is not the way of Islam.
|11/09/05 at 00:48:11|
|Re: Tear Gas Bomb Blats in Mosque in a Parisian Su|
|11/09/05 at 02:12:45|
This is really sad and tragic.
However France is unique among European countries in that even if you've been there for 5 generations but look like you are from North Africa or have a Muslim name you will never be considered "French". People will say that you are North African but live in France. You will not be classified as "French." This is in stark contrast to say America, where you can live there for 5 years, get a US passport and suddenly many people do consider you fully American. And even if you are considered a hyphenated American -- there is surprisingly little stigma attached to that. Now, I won't say that there isn't a glass ceiling to how high an muslim American can rise in business or governemnt or society in a place like America or Britain. But the ceiling is definately a lot higher than it is in France where it seems to be at about knee level.
What it basically boils down to is that the French are deeply ethnocentric and racism seems to be in the blood of many of the French. It's not a coincidence that they sold many of Jews down the river to the Nazis duirng WWII. Nor is it a coincidence that they armed the the Rawandans who comitted genocide while they were committing genocide. Nor is it coincidence that they armed Iraq and I think Iran during the Iraq-Iran war. And it would be naive to think that they opposed the Iraq war on principle and not to protect their financial agreements with Iraq and not because they resent American dominance.
Sorry about the negative post. But there is a real problem in France and the French and North African communities really do dislike each other a lot. In fact just ask a French muslim what he thinks about France and you will be shocked and then ask a French Christian about Muslims and you will only be slightly less shocked.
|Re: Tear Gas Bomb Blats in Mosque in a Parisian Su|
|11/09/05 at 08:13:37|
|Muslims say anger not religion drives French riots |
uploaded 08 Nov 2005
TRAPPES, France, - For the young Muslims who live in the gritty Merisiers apartment blocks in this town to the west of Paris, the riots that have affected their neighbourhood and dozens of urban areas across the country over the last 12 days have nothing to do with religion.
"Why did they ask the imam of the Paris mosque to calm down the youths?" asked Saidou, 22, the self-appointed spokesman for a group of boys in the neighbourhood.
A third of Trappes' 28,000 residents are Muslims, according to local officials.
"The violence is a phenomenon of society. Islam has nothing to do with it," he added.
A 17-year-old who left school three years ago said bluntly: "We want to make war. To let loose on the cops. They're looking for a fight. As long as (Interior Minister Nicolas) Sarkozy is around, we'll keep burning cars. We'll burn society," he added.
In Trappes, 27 buses worth 3.5 million euros (4.1 million dollars) were torched and destroyed in their depot.
"Do they have to wait for us to riot for there to be dialogue? We've appealed for help, they don't care. It's been going on for 30 years. Even we don't know how it will end," said Saidou.
On Monday night alone, some 1,173 vehicles were burnt in towns and cities across France and some 330 people were arrested.
The previous night, it was 1,400 torched cars and 395 arrests.
The youths behind the violence are mostly drawn from the large Muslim communities.
"Whenever there is a problem in a country, its the Muslims (who are blamed)," said Karim.
"It's not the Muslims, it's people who are in dire straits. I've got a qualification in construction. I'm in construction, but because I have no choice. There is work, but they give us the dirty work.
"What's our future? We are condemned to stay in the high rises!," he added.
"Are we trash, or what?" asked another man, an electrician who asked not to be named.
"Instead of helping us, they send us riot police. It's been going on for years. We can't take it any more. The police do as they like, so we allow ourselves to do as we like," he added.
"They want to take away our dignity, but they never will," said another estate resident, Zoubir.
On Tuesday, Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin unveiled a raft of social and economic measures designed to improve conditions in such tough, low-income neighbourhoods by reducing chronically high unemployment, providing better education and combatting entrenched racism.
Many of the areas affected by the initiatives are impoverished districts on the periphery of cities and towns populated predominantly by families that immigrated from North Africa and former French colonies in sub-Saharan Africa.
Source: Tehran Times
I am not giving a Fatwa ordering Muslims to riot. What I am saying is that actions have reactions.
The media seem to have very short memories. A lot of things happened before the execution of the two boys (they were not criminals).
The Muslims did respond with peacefulness. They demonstrated peacefully and it was the police who turned the peaceful demonstrations in to riots with teargas grenades and beatings. When riots started, it was the police who caused them to spread throughout the country by attacking Musjids with teargas while people within them were prostrating to their lord.
It was the police who went about randomly beating up young people with brown faces all over the country, and it was this action of utter stupidity which caused the riots to spread all over the country.
I am not saying rioting is a good or bad response to what the police did, What I am saying is that it is an inevitable consequences. Riots will happen when you treat people or even animals like this.
The Chirac appointed Muslim leadership of France have blindly supported the government on this, just like they have blindly supported the government on everything else.
So it is not suppressing that the rioters have not obeyed them. Obeying them is now seen as obeying the Zionist government.
A lot of the young are saying it is anger not religion which is causing them to riot. Well, if the self appointed and Chirac appointed spokesmen of religion carry on supporting Chirac while defying the young, they will turn the young away from Islam.
If they only hear the spokesmen of religion attack them while praising their enemies, they will see Islam as the opium of the masses. And will look for another ideology to guide their struggle.
This has happened before:
At first the Russians fought Muslims by fighting Islam. They would kill Muslim men and forcedly marry Muslim girls to Christian soldiers etc. But this wasn’t working. Later Russian emperors hired Ulima to preach peaceful Islam while oppressing the populous in general and Muslims in particular. Muslims were oppressed so had to fight back. The ulima refused to support the struggle so the Muslims fought for communism. Most of the Red Army was Muslim while most of the White Army was Christian. The Red Army wan and the Russian Empire became a communist state. Soon after the communist took power the communists started wiping out the Muslims and Islam.
If you remove Islam from the legitimate struggle of Muslims, you don’t stop them struggling. What you do is cause them to remove themselves from Islam and cause them to look elsewhere to liberate themselves.
Islam was a key factor in the liberation struggles in America and South Africa; this is why so many blacks in those places have converted to Islam.
Not all the rioters are Muslim, if we support them a lot of them will become Muslim.
We don’t need to support each and every one of their methods to support them. But we have to let them know, they have every right to be angry. They are right and the French government is wrong.
It is misleading to assume that Muslims only make up 10% of France. Almost all of the people over the age of 40 are white Christians. And 35% of under 20 are Muslims. Soon enough the Muslims will become the majority, and if things remain the same, France will become what South Africa was. So their struggle should be seen in the same light as the struggle in South Africa.
The people who attack these rioters should ask themselves, The same things happened during apatite in South Africa, did you oppose those?
|Re: Tear Gas Bomb Blats in Mosque in a Parisian Su|
|11/24/05 at 00:17:13|
|The French Riots and the Blame Game |
[i]Tuesday, Nov 22nd, 2005[/i]
In examining the recent riots across France, it is tempting to level blame on the supposedly irreconcilable differences between the secular West and Islam. The rioters, after all, were largely the children of Muslim migrants from North and West Africa; and the target of their rage was, after all, an archetypal secular polity. If much of the commentary is to be believed, these riots represent the opening battle in some sort of European intifada or an al-Qaeda inspired push to re-establish the Caliphate in the Parisian suburbs.
However, it is a lazy and simplistic reading of the situation that impugns Islam for these riots. Rather, the violence had little to do with some Muslim hostility towards democracy, but everything to do with economic problems that are largely unique to the socialist economies of ‘old Europe’.
Unlike Australia, the United States, and the United Kingdom, France does not recognise multiculturalism. Migrants must assimilate and the state has undertaken a series of aggressive measures – such as banning Islamic hijab in public schools – to push the process along.
Integration is, however, more than merely forcing migrants to adopt some vacuous notion of ‘Frenchness’. It is not enough that new entrants merely embrace some cultural affectations and give their children French names. Perhaps more importantly, migrants must be integrated economically. It is only by working, earning money and being financially independent that a person develops the self-respect and dignity needed to be a productive member of the social and cultural fabric of the society. This is where France has failed: whilst it has demanded its migrants assimilate culturally, the economy has offered little opportunity for economic assimilation.
The French economy is growing at just 1.2% and has one of the highest rates of youth unemployment in Europe. For those under 25, the unemployment rate is 22% (approximately twice the rate of the United States and Britain). In the banlieues, where the riots erupted, youth unemployment is estimated to run at over 50%.
These alarmingly high levels of youth unemployment are caused by a rigid French labour market. France has one of the highest minimum wages in Europe and its workers enjoy the protection of strong unions and a variety of regulations that force short 35-hour work weeks, generous state pensions, and long holidays. It is very difficult for companies to rationalise staff numbers or hire temporarily. Meanwhile, with government spending accounting for roughly half the GDP and an escalating pension and social security burden, individuals and businesses endure stiflingly heavy taxation.
As a result, the French economy produces a miniscule number of new jobs each year as compared to the United Kingdom or United States. The high minimum wage exacerbates the problem by making it expensive to hire new staff. The result is obvious: businesses will discriminate in favour of job applicants with closer cultural ties to the dominant culture, more experience or already employed.
Therefore, migrants and the children of migrants are pushed to the margins. They are told that they are French by a system that refuses to recognise the multicultural face of French society, yet when they attempt to find employment soon realise that they are not competing on an equal footing. With laws preventing the collection of any statistical data based on ethnicity or religion, the French government remains blissfully unaware of these problems. This, in turn, builds resentment and a feeling of alienation amongst the young who find themselves excluded with no hope of economic or social ascent.
Instead of addressing the root causes of unemployment, the French government has plied these poor neighbourhoods with public funds: government housing, hospitals, and generous social security payments. An emasculating dependence on handouts, aggressive demands of cultural assimilation, and yet little reciprocal hope of economic integration has created the cultural milieu that begot these riots.
In competitive, relatively liberalised labour markets, the ongoing demand for labour ensures employers cannot readily afford to discriminate on the irrelevent basis of race or religion. It is for this reason that ethnic groups in more liberal economies do not face the same social problems as those in countries such as France and its neighbours. It is also for this reason that it is unlikely that similar riots would ever occur in Australia or the United States. Regardless of what some opportunists now warn.
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