// 99 names and nothing like him. Contradiction in Koran.
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Author Topic: 99 names and nothing like him. Contradiction in Koran.  (Read 7630 times)
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lucid
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« Reply #25 on: Sep 11, 2008 09:53 AM »

1) the names of God, are infinite -- in fact uncountably infinite.  the simplest like "the king" etc, are meant to convey in LAYMEN'S vocabulary some attribute of God. 

2) given an attribute like power, one is supposed to then take the limit of the attribute going to infinity.  if you wish you can think of it like taking a calculus limit where the argument x --> infinity.  clearly in taking this limit, such an attribute is "unlike any belonging to creation."

3) the other names of God are presumably more precise but difficult to describe using clumsy written words.  they are probably described more aptly using mathematical terminology,  however even that is hard.

4) your real issue is the following:  is the designer of the universe, which is 15 billion light years across, a personal God?  Does God have anything to do with insignificant clumps of stardust like us? 

Most athiests believe in some sort of design in the universe (after all, remarkably, the universe is comprehensible).  However they cannot make any connection between that agent of design (what we call God) and created beings like us.  What should this agent of design have to do with us, they say? 

The usual answer to that is formal religion:  religious texts, and religious experiences.   If religious texts make sense to you, and not seem like a sham, then you will be inclined to believe that the agent of design really really is the agent of good mentioned in whatever scriptural text you are reading.  Also, people have personal experiences whereby they put their trust in their "personal" God and pray for help, assistance.  Many people believe that their prayers are answered, at least in part, and that helps solidify their belief that the agent of design is a God which actually has something to with humans, etc....

5) About monotheism,  well the universe seems to make sense and seems to be governed by a UNIFIED set of laws.  The agent of design, assuming it exists, must also show manifest unity in itself.  This means the agent is presumably one, or at least unified into one broad cause. 

In fact nobody ever seriously believed in polytheism.  Everybody really believed in in different attributes of the One taking special importance  -- which eventually became known to people as various Gods and Goddesses, etc.  Almost always, this warping of the God concept was financially motivated -- more Gods for people to serve = more money for priests and religious orders.  Islam came to wipe out this kind of petty financial relgiousity, and so on...

So monotheism is the cleanest implementation of the God concept....polytheism seems to make the whole God idea a joke...

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« Reply #26 on: Oct 03, 2008 09:15 AM »

salaam to all, like I said earlier i'm an old member of medinah.

  This is an answer to the bro called Lukes,we humans are never satisfied sometimes we really think we are very smart to think of some things, bro lukes wud like you to look at these examples and see if u cud even explain it logically
first of all we believe Allah is every where,u myt as well try to say that does not make sense but if i put some sugar in a cup of milk or any drink,can u tell me the sugar is not everywhere in the drink?
U own your body but can you stop or controll the things that happen to it?what other language wud the Almighty have used to describe himself to us if not in terms that we can understand? some people see beyond others, Allah is great and there is simply none that can be compared to Him.

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rahma
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« Reply #27 on: Oct 03, 2008 10:54 AM »

Assalaamu Alaykum.

Anonymous stated: "first of all we believe Allah is every where"

Allah is not everywhere.  Allah is on his throne in heaven.  Please correct me if I'm wrong.
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« Reply #28 on: Oct 05, 2008 04:39 AM »

(1) first of all the throne -- arsh of allah -- is something only allah knows; it has not been described to us.  it is not something physical in this 4 dimensional  world.  it is better for us to think of it metaphorically.

(2) we do not say allah is everywhere, or allah is here or there.  since allah is not a physical entity bound by our 4 dimensional (created spacetime), such statements mean nothing.  it is perhaps best to say that the allah's reach extends everywhere, his presence is unbounded.  by stating it this way, we don't make statements about the physical nature of God, but rather his attributes...
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« Reply #29 on: Oct 05, 2008 05:28 AM »

wsalam,

I believe the way scholars explain 'Allah is Everywhere' is that Allah's Knowledge is everywhere but He physically cannot be contained in 4 dimensional space as was mentioned. laysa kamithlihi shay. There is nothing like Him, so of course even trying to discuss this as the limited created beings we are is kind of silly. Also, this debate has been hashed out centuries ago by the scholars so let's move on.
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« Reply #30 on: Oct 05, 2008 07:33 AM »

Salam

As I have mentioned before, the great Orientalist Toynbee said " If you want to confuse the Muslims its easy. Just take an old issue, give them a new interpretation and you get them confused".

Wassalam
rahma
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« Reply #31 on: Oct 05, 2008 03:08 PM »

Sorry.

I didn't mean to bring up an old debate. 

I just kinda wince whenever anyone says "Allah is everywhere".
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