// OBL's son Wants Peace and Truce !
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jannah
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« on: Jan 18, 2008 06:14 AM »


Wow. Where was he all this time? He's definitely doing good so far except he should have totally renounced al-qaida and all aspects of violence and not defended anything.

===========================

news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080118/ap_on_re_mi_ea/bin_laden_s_son_7

Bin Laden son wants to be peace activist


Omar Osama bin Laden bears a striking resemblance to his notorious father — except for the dreadlocks that dangle halfway down his back. Then there's the black leather biker jacket. The 26-year-old does not renounce his father, al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden, but in an interview with The Associated Press, he said there is better way to defend Islam than militancy: Omar wants to be an "ambassador for peace" between Muslims and the West.

Omar — one of bin Laden's 19 children — raised a tabloid storm last year when he married a 52-year-old British woman, Jane Felix-Browne, who took the name Zaina Alsabah. Now the couple say they want to be advocates, planning a 3,000-mile horse race across North Africa to draw attention to the cause of peace.

"It's about changing the ideas of the Western mind. A lot of people think Arabs — especially the bin Ladens, especially the sons of Osama — are all terrorists. This is not the truth," Omar told the AP last week at a cafe in a Cairo shopping mall.

Of course, many may have a hard time getting their mind around the idea of "bin Laden: peacenik."

"Omar thinks he can be a negotiator," said Alsabah, who is trying to bring her husband to Britain. "He's one of the only people who can do this in the world."

Omar lived with the al-Qaida leader in Sudan, then moved with him to Afghanistan in 1996.

There, Omar says he trained at an al-Qaida camp but in 2000 he decided there must be another way and he left his father, returning to his homeland of Saudi Arabia.

"I don't want to be in that situation to just fight. I like to find another way and this other way may be like we do now, talking," he said in English.

He suggested his father did not oppose his leaving — and Alsabah interjected that Omar was courageous in breaking away, but neither elaborated.

Although there is no way to confirm the details he describes of his childhood and upbringing, the strong family resemblance and Omar's knowledge of Osama's family life have convinced many of his lineage.

"Omar Bin Laden is the son of Osama bin Laden and his first wife, Najwa," a U.S. intelligence official said Thursday, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media. The official confirmed Omar was raised in Sudan and Afghanistan after his father was forced out of Saudi Arabia.

Omar and his wife insist they have not been bothered by Egyptian officials, who said Thursday that the terror leader's son did not pose a threat.

"He comes and goes just like any other tourist," said a security official, also speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the media. "He is taking a line that is totally different from him father."

Omar said he hasn't seen or been in contact with his father since leaving Afghanistan. "He doesn't have e-mail," Omar said. "He doesn't take a telephone ... if he had something like this, they will find him through satellites."

Omar doesn't criticize his father and says Osama bin Laden is just trying to defend the Islamic world.

"My father thinks he will be good for defending the Arab people and stop anyone from hurting the Arab or Muslim people any place in the world," he said, noting that the West didn't have a problem with his father when he was fighting the Russians in Afghanistan in the 1980s.

Omar is convinced a truce between the West and al-Qaida is possible.

"My father is asking for a truce but I don't think there is any government (that) respects him. At the same time they do not respect him, why everywhere in the world, they want to fight him? There is a contradiction," he said.

Osama bin Laden, believed to be in hiding in the Pakistan-Afghan border region, offered a truce to Europe in a 2004 audiotape and a conditional truce to the United States in a 2006 message. In November, he called on European nations to pull out of Afghanistan in a message seen by some experts as an effort to reach out to Europe.

But in a series of messages since last fall, he also has been calling for Muslims to rally around jihad, or "holy war," encouraging fighters in Iraq in particular to continue their battles with U.S. and Iraqi forces.

At least two of Osama bin Laden's sons, Hamza and Saad, are believed to have an active role in al-Qaida — with Hamza believed to be in the Pakistan-Afghan border zone and Saad thought to be in Iran, perhaps in Iranian custody.

But most of the al-Qaida leader's children, like Omar, live as legitimate businessmen. The family as a whole disowned Osama in 1994 when Saudi Arabia stripped him of his citizenship because of his militant activities.

The family is wealthy: Osama bin Laden's billionaire father Mohammed, who died in 1967, had more than 50 children and founded the Binladen Group, a construction conglomerate that gets many major building contracts in the kingdom.

Since leaving his father's side, Omar has lived in Saudi Arabia, where he runs a contracting company connected with the Binladen Group, but he spends much of his time in Egypt. It was during a desert horseback ride at the Pyramids of Giza that he met his wife.

Their marriage in April made them tabloid fodder, particularly in Britain, where headlines touted the "granny who married Osama bin Laden's son." Alsabah, who has married five times, has five grandchildren.

The couple has applied for a visa to Britain. And they are planning their endurance horse race across North Africa, which they hope to start in March. It is in the planning stages — they are seeking approval of governments along the route and need sponsors to help pay for the event and raise money for child victims of war.

Omar said they plan to ride 30 miles a day, with periodic weeklong rests in each country.

Teams from around the world will be encouraged to join in what the couple envisions as an equine version of the Paris-Dakar car rally. That rally was canceled this year due to fears over terrorist threats made by al-Qaida-affiliated groups in North Africa.

Omar, however, said he isn't worried.

"I heard the rally was stopped because of al-Qaida," he said. "I don't think they are going to stop me."





Omar Osama bin Laden, right, and his British wife Jane Felix-Brown, now known as Zaina Alsabah, 52 are seen during an interview with the Associated Press in Cairo, Egypt, Friday, Jan. 11, 2008. The 26-year-old son of the al-Qaida leader does not renounce his father in an interview with The Associated Press, but says there is a better way to defend Islam: Omar wants to be an 'ambassador for peace' between Muslims and the West
cheese
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« Reply #1 on: Jan 20, 2008 01:47 AM »

May Allah grant him a hair cut, his wife a Hijab and his thobebro victory
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« Reply #2 on: Jan 20, 2008 02:57 AM »

his what victory?

and if he had all those things he would never be able to make as much effective dawah as he is now. sometimes people have to realize that those muslims on the fringes of islam are sometimes the best ambassadors. and the so called "religious" people are often the ones that turn OFF everyone around them to islam.  something to think about.

ws
cheese
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« Reply #3 on: Jan 20, 2008 04:42 PM »

I have never met anyone who has ever told me that they converted to Islam because some one denounced a Muslim group, or condemned violence.
Have you met anyone who converted to Islam because they saw a Muslim with dreadlocks? Or they know of a Muslim man with a wife who does not wear Hijab?

People don’t think they need to change any aspect of their lives if they learn about another way of life that is similar to their own.

The conversion process involves learning of something that is different to the current way of life. Thought over which is correct. Deciding that the current way is wrong and the other way is right. Making the decision to changing. Acting according to the decision, and changing.

The starting point has to be learning that Islam is different from what they currently have.
Dawa has to show them that their way is wrong, and Islam is right.

I’m glad he didn’t condemn his father  thobebro , Muslim groups or their activities. We got to much of that already and that is really bad for dawa. I have never met anyone who converted to Islam when he heard a speech where Muslims were attacking Muslims, have you?
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« Reply #4 on: Jan 21, 2008 05:09 PM »

maybe you live on a different planet mr. cheese....

people are drawn to islam because of the sincerity of its believers and the moderate nature of its beliefs. 

my roommate converted after 3 weeks....

why do you think people convert?Huh??

and what is wrong with dreds?Huh?  and hijab or no hijab is a very false barometer for testing the piety of a muslim women....

cheese
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« Reply #5 on: Jan 21, 2008 05:55 PM »

The only way to determine a good Muslim from a bad one is Iman and Amal.
Only Allah can look in to someone’s heart and see their Iman, so Muslims can only judge each other by amal.
Hijab is ordered by the Quran, so judging by apparent Amal alone, her Amal is clearly wrong, and so is his for allowing her to go out in public with her head uncovered.
Is Hijab the only commandment that does not affect piety? Or would you consider eating pork, Zina, burying daughters alive, taking riba and drinking Alcohol as false barometers for piety?

“people are drawn to islam because of the sincerity of its believers and the moderate nature of its beliefs. “

This is perhaps the most moronic way to choose a religion. People join cults and false religions because believers in cults and false religions seem to be sincere and the beliefs of cults are seen as moderate to all, because cults chop and change their beliefs to please everyone. Cults and other false religions are made up by men; so they are agreeable to men. And if some men find some of there teachings extreme, the teachings are modified to make them moderate to all.

People join Islam because Islam is clearly the truth and all other religions are clearly false. Islam does not chop and change itself to please everyone, so Islam is never moderate. Islam is Islam. It is the revelation of Allah. Whether people like it or not they have to accept it.
Everyone who truly converts to Islam does so because they believe Islam is the truth and their farmer religion was false.

Ask your friend whether he converted because he thought that Muslims were nice sincere people as opposed to people from his former religion being insincere or because he believed that Islam is the truth as opposed to his former religion being false.
You will be pleasantly surprised. Converts convert due to belief in Allah and Islam, not belief in Muslims and their sincerity.
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« Reply #6 on: Jan 21, 2008 06:20 PM »

My point is that many people who are not "perfect" Muslims do better dawah than those who consider themselves "perfect".

No one is saying become a non-muslim to do dawah.

When people feel that Islam is not the "enemy", the "other", religion for foreigners, when they have that psychological space that I can be Muslim and who I am, this is when people convert. And yes, many people have converted post 9/11 when they took that step to find out about Islam and realized it was not what it is portrayed in the media. When they have heard real Islam and that it condemns violence against civilians and that it does not condone what OBL, Al-Qaida or any terrorists of that ilk, that's when they realize Islam is good.

Also, you cannot judge someone like that, you may be able to judge one single action, but as you said you don't know anything about the person's iman OR amal OR intention.

Quote
Islam is never moderate.

Where did you get that from? Islam IS the moderate way. We are ummatul wassatiyah. We are in the best, middle, MODERATE way of living.
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« Reply #7 on: Jan 21, 2008 08:37 PM »

Asalamualaikum wrt,

It is strange that no one in this thread began their post with the Islamic greeting, aslamualaikum wrt.  We should great each other with the greetings of peace, as we are brothers and sisters of one another, the way the Prophet (s) taught us.


Maybe its because the Arabic salam graphic is too huge, jannah can you fix that? Smiley


We all have to make an effort to propogate the knowledge of Islam and keep it going, so people follow the true religion, and the Muslims do not turn back on their heals and apostate.

Unfortunately I know of Muslims, who were activists and involved in organizing events and so on, who ended up apostating from the religion.  This has happened to several people I have known, even in my own community.

What lesson can we learn from this?:

1.  It is important for all Muslims to learn their religion well from the Imams and Shaikhs, and have Fiqh of the religion.  A tree with strong roots will not fall in the wind.


2.  Dawah is not only for non-Muslims.  We need to make dawah to Muslims so they don't apostate.


3.  We have to make dua' to Allah that we die on the faith, the Kalimah of Haq La illaha illa Allah, Muhammadur Rasoolalah.  What has a person gained if they obtain all of the dunya, and they lose their afterlife?



 

Be merciful to those on earth, and the One in the Heavens will be merciful to you.
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« Reply #8 on: Jan 25, 2008 12:02 AM »

As salaamu alaikum

I'm sure his interview sparked quite a bit of discussion among many.  I caught the interview that was done on one of the morning news programs.  While okay the hairstyle was unexpected, I focused more on what as said (granted I was in a rush to head to work on time but wanted to hear the interview).  One thing I noticed is that his wife didn't hesitate to speak to the fact that dialogue is needed and that if it was done with the IRA which was deemed a "terrorist" group then no less should be done in this instance.  Further it was elaborated that such would be the better course of action because to continue to "hunt" bin Laden and ultimately cause his death would most likely incite further violence which has no merit nor benefit to anyone.  Seems logical; afterall killing Saddam didn't make conditions better in Iraq but rather made them vastly worse. 

Peaceful resolution to anything is always better than a violent one, in my opinion.

Hijab is ordered by the Quran, so judging by apparent Amal alone, her Amal is clearly wrong, and so is his for allowing her to go out in public with her head uncovered.


What gets my scarf in a bunch is when I see a visibily Muslim sister walking with her husband who visibily doesn't appear to be Muslim.  In some instances that sister is subject to dirty looks since the appearance is that she is with a non-Muslim man.  Where's the fairness in that?



Unfortunately I know of Muslims, who were activists and involved in organizing events and so on, who ended up apostating from the religion.  This has happened to several people I have known, even in my own community.
 

This is unfortunate indeed.  The sad but harsh reality is that often it is the reaction of the very people they strive to advocate for that turns them away out of frustration.  Standing on the forefront of issues that impact the ummah and not getting the support from the ummah is very unpleasant as well as heartbreaking and discouraging and leaves one wondering "why bother" (been there, asked that; too stubborn to back down but I really just should) and lends itself to some just clamming up and watching things unfold as they go unchallenged and others as you said to step away from an otherwise beautiful way of life.  People sure do have a way of messing up stuff.

As salaamu alaikum

Fa'izah
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« Reply #9 on: Jan 25, 2008 02:54 PM »

“I see a visibily Muslim sister walking with her husband who visibily doesn't appear to be Muslim.”
Are you sure the dirty looks aren’t because she is wearing Hijab, and a lot of people including Muslims hate Hijab?
Niqab/Hijab wearing women seem to get dirty looks whoever they are with, and more so when they are alone.
Semi-nude women get complements, because some people assume they are good for dawa. While some brothers who desperate to get married talk to them nicely with the excuse of dawa.

But anyway, it seems to be acceptable for men to wear whatever clothes they like. No one has heard of a Silwar Kamis ban in France, or a Juba ban in Tunisia.
Who has heard of atheists complaining about how Muslims oppress their boys by forcing them to wear foreign clothes.
Hijab and Niqab are what they are targeting. This is because they are what Allah has ordered and their real target is Allah. So they target what women should wear without targeting what men can wear and they claim to speak for women.
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